Talk:Chara/@comment-32182236-20171231225824/@comment-32182236-20180212153728
"I doesn't mentionned that Love weak monsters damages on you because you distance yourself(source sans dialogue).That and increases of damages on them its the only thing established in the game regards love." Yeah, that is what Sans says, but the real question is simply this:How dos that even work with physics? Humans are made of physical matter, so their persistence shouldn't be affected by non-physical quantities. (And Alphys proved that DT is indeed a physical thing.) "For "the failure "is very linked to the context of the job(which is proven to be in the demo)in the genocide run.So when Snowdrake run away its "a failure "of your job." That would be correct. Your job is to kill everyone. But who GAVE you that job? =) "But as you can continue your massacre without killing him if Chara let you,i believe that Chara make the job aborted because you proven them that "kill or be killed" rule isn't absolute as you failled to kill a monster (maybe its the same reason of why they'll stop genocide if you doesn't clean an area)." Actually, the job is aborted because it's become impossible to complete. Since Snowdrake got away, you can't kill everyone, you can't get NEO to show up and kill him in one hit, and you can't fight and kill Sans. Your LV will be, at maximum, 18 in the end. Chara wants the maximum 20. No lower will no. (The bar might even be higher, considering two more kills happened after this, which would yield even more EXP) "And Yes i know that Chara's mind doesn't change if you spare a random monster but its likely because they probably think that you will kill them(they still provide the kill count)." Except even if you don't, as long as it isn't a unique encounter, it still works. For example, if there's "1 left", you can spare the Jerry and wait for a monster that yields more EXP. By doing this, Jerry lives. So.. Why does Chara still believe it's absolute again? ("The job", on the other hand, is to kill a certain number of monsters in each area, so you can fight NEO, then Sans, and max out your LV.) "And AGAIN what make you think that Chara want genocide since the beginning and that they wait 10 min in the void in order to make you bored?" Because why else would they assume you want to recreate the old world? Since we have no choice to actually move onto the next world, staying in the void for 10 minutes would happen either way. That's where Frisk is trapped. They can't exactly leave the void lol, so staying there for 10 minutes shouldn't tell Chara anything. They'd have no reason to take that as a message Frisk wants to go back to the world they just destroyed 10 minutes ago. But.. If Chara is doing this to manipulate Frisk... "And if Chara really wants to destroy the world to make you boring (which would make them easier to get your soul) and that they know thats world's destruction isn't your goal then they wouldn't even ask you if you want the world's destruction or not but would erase the world immediately without your imput(even if you was never in control of the mission,Chara thinks that you kill all the monsters for this exact goal)" Um, no. World destruction IS our goal. What's not our goal is to stay around in a void for eternity after destroying a mere ONE world. You said we'd move onto the next world, partner. Take us there, so we can finish the job there too. =) The action they take to bore us is not destroying the world (we wanted that), but to decide to make us wait around in a void instead of taking us to the next world to destroy. "Also ,the reason of why Chara follows Frisk's guidance despite them being a human its very likely because they doesn't care whatever they are ,they likely doesn't trust themself at all after their plan was failled so they watch what Frisk does(Which explains why Chara describes the events,they want to know how Frisk reacts regads a situation)." Chara, you know, maybe the reason you seem to be a failure is because you're a human too, right? Don't trust another human like yourself, go seek the guidance of goatmom. She was much better, after all, right? (Yes, I'm taking the stance of Chara's "hatred of humanity" here, but only to argue against what Chara did. I'm presenting something else Chara SHOULD have done, if what you argue is indeed true.) "If Chara hate Frisk and dont trust them then Chara wouldn't say"You're a great partner we're be together forever wont we?"" They still betray you. Maybe WE shouldn't have trusted THEM. The only reason why they helped us kill is because they too wanted the monsters dead. They were using us. They stop helping you out like that RIGHT when you stop the genocide. I mean, they go right from calling us a great partner to saying this is all our fault and scolding us. ...Which one seems more in character for someone who hates humanity? "And come on if you believe that Chara is the narrator then they help you in every path such by giving information about items,monsters and helping to save Asriel by sharing their memories (since you need memories that you share with each of your friend to save them)." Those "flashbacks" of Asriel could be deduced from the story the monsters gave in New Home. Now do you see why it take a Neutral Run first before you can do a Pacifist run? :3 Also, each time it's info on items or monsters, they're presented as statistics. They even insist on speaking through the HUD-And no, the HUD isn't speaking through them, because we don't see their icon like with everyone else. "Reading this doesn't seem like the best use of your time"-Sans Genocide Battle, Phase 2 Flavor Text Narrator's aware of the HUD. It's almost as if they want us to treat this world as a game, and play through it mathematically... "Also if Chara really doesn't care about your guidance then they wouldn't say "with your guidance a"(they would say "with your help"as in the second genocide end)and "WHY they were brought back to life"(if Chara talk about your determination that awoke them here then they would say "How i was brought back to life "instead of 'Why"because thats how language works)" They were wondering what they were doing back alive? Why aren't they dead? Besides, as I pointed out, there's a period after "With your guidance", rather than a comma, which should be there if your interpretation is correct. "or "Thanks for leading me i realized for what i was awoke its power"(note:is in the official Japanese version entirely under the direction of Toby Fox i used google translate to translate that word after word lol)" Translators in general aren't very effective. This is because when something's literally translated into another language, meaning is lost, and others assumed-For example, translating "you" into Japanese using this would always get you the same word, despite the fact that there's many forms of "you" that should be used depending on context. Similar problems exist with Japenese back to English, because a Japenese word might mean more than one English word, so the translator just picks the most commonly used one... Which is sometimes false.. Here, translate intro narration of Undertale into Japanese, then back into English, and spot the differences. (Use Google Translate like before). Here's the intro to translate: |Long ago, two races over the earth:Humans and Monsters. One day, war broke out between the two races. After a long battle, the humans were victorious. They sealed the monsters underground. Legends say that those who climb the mountain never return...| "Again soulles pacifist ending only implies that your friends were killed since their faces are crossed,if Chara really wants to get the surface to destroy humanity then 1.They would give the last soul needed to destroy humanity to Asgore" You're why they exist in the first place. Without your determination, they can't live on. Besides, letting Asgore do it means Chara can't kill Asgore. "2.In neutral runs ,there would be implications that Chara destroyed humanity but the fact is,there is no implication that anything is wrong" Frisk doesn't cross the barrier in a Neutral Run. Plus, Chara doesn't gain physical form until at the lowest LV20. "3.Love doesn't allow to hurt humans because they are physical" Your True Knife does. =) "I believe that its "your consequences "since by recreating the world you proven them that's you killed every monster for fun only and not for "a job"as destroy the world." Considering how Chara considers the Dogi being killed as "funny", Chara seems to be doing this for fun too... But they plan on it staying that way. Besides, they're the one who assumed you wanted to recreate the world, and never gave you the chance to destroy another world. They're the ones that, after 10 minutes, supposedly just ASSUME we want to recreate the world, with no basis to said assumption whatsoever. "Chara likely think its unfair to let you live with the people you killed for fun happily ever after."You think you are above consequences "as Chara says but you wrong, here are your consequences:you could never live happily with the people you killed for fun.As for the reason why they are be able to kill the people they once loved i believe its because they are souless(they are lack of empathy something that a soulles person couldn't feel"I cant understand these feelings anymore"and compassion,which is due to our empathy,which is indicated by Flowey who only recognise Chara in genocide run and describes them as "empty" "you are empty inside just like me in fact you are Chara"and even him cannot feel compassion with the lack of a soul"my compassion disappeared ")." Flowey was also soulless, but he cared for his friends until he decided he'd start killing for fun because he was bored with the SAVE ability. At first he used his new powers for good! But, in Chara's case, there is no case of them starting off good. "But that's doesn't mean that Chara doesn't feel anything at all for them,perhaps they feel guilt to kill them(its implicated by their reaction of the family photo which is "*......"is red,a color that shows a strong emotion)" ...That's them looking at it in a Genocide Run. In the Tainted Pacifist, looking at the photo... does nothing. You just see that Chara replaced Frisk, and killed their friends. "or sadness to confronts them(which is implies by their very serios tone during their fights)." ...Really? Being serious implies sadness? No! They're serious because they treat this like a GAME. The goal and job is to kill them, and they will take that job seriously. "And i dont see any reason for Chara completely changed after they death,after all they holds every memories of the fallen human(the plan ,Asgore words and so on),still have a childish personality ("look at these cool toys","butspie","No chocolate ")and even Flowey still the same as Asriel exept he cannot feel compassion ("My compassion disappeared ")and empathy ("But with all those souls inside of me i not only brought my compassion back but i can feel every other monster as well")and love "without those souls i couldn't feel love anymore"" Flowey tried to be good at first. Chara didn't even do that. While their lack of a SOUL may have indeed played a part on why they're different, it can't be the full story. Also, they still have a childish personality because they're still a child. "Toby Fox said himself when a fan asked him why they cannot found any merch of Chara,thats its because its would be "a trivialization of what they stands for in the game and the message they carry"and aded that its nice that this fan like Chara so much." And then Toby actually DID release merch of Chara-An official Chara tarot card. Therefore, this comment was a joke/troll answer. "So i think that's Chara is the last and important message thats the game provides;thats even a person that's seems to be absolutely evil can be a nice one if we took pain to try to understand them.After all everything is dark regards Chara in the game,they laughed when Asgore was poisoned,they convinced Asriel to take 6 souls and let them die despite the fact that's he really wasn't comfortable with that,they hated humanity,they was the one that wanted to use Asriel's full power against his will against humans that's would wage war,Asriel describe them as "not really the greatest person",they appear in genocide end and destroy tge whole world ,they kill your friends in a soulles pacifist run ,they make a jumpscare,they seems to conntrol the cutscenes in genocide run,they call themself a demon,their face is only showed in the genocide run ending,." Yeah, and some of them weren't actually evil, like laughing the buttercup incident off (not laughting AT it, really, Chara probably thought the pun was funny). Chara's plan was to free the monsters. Everything up to their death wasn't pure evil. But everything AFTER their death was. "But Flowey was also implied to be the absolute jerk without any single good quality by the game but latter was revealed to be a very heartwarming guy who was only misguided,even when he becomes Flowey again he show that's he is concerned for Frisk's friends and Frisk's future(source:his dialogue after the true pacifist 's credits)." He's going to become evil again too. For the same reason as the first time, as well. Just wait until he starts SAVING and LOADing again. "So why Chara wouldn't be the same thing exept its only IMPLIED they are nice at the end of the day not EXPLICITED because the game wants us to take pain to try to understand them?" Because Chara did FAR worse than Flowey, and as I explained, they never even TRIED to be good after their death. Even so, evidence suggests they don't have some secret good intentions.. I mean, what could they possibly be? (Also, Flowey, as FLOWEY, very well IS evil.) "PS:Its also a common misconception that's determination is the red soul,that's not the case:determination is the willingness to live thats every living creature have(exept,flowers maybe its because they are not minded ?),humans have the most (for me its because they fear death more than anyone so they want live to overcome death).Plus it is never written in red color in the game,which is another misconception(tested that myself) even in the ball game.And there is another misconception that other traits cannot be so determined as red because its was proven that all fallen humans had recept power" How? Really, I'd say it was proven NONE of the fallen humans had reset power, due to the fact that they all died to Asgore.